Trash the Truth & Those Who Tell It
What happened on Christmas night 1997?
I know a little about the concept of “shooting the messenger” as I’ve taken a few hits over the years for the things that I’ve written. That comes with the territory. I doubt the people who are so quick to pass judgment on others and their missteps in life – as portrayed in a book – know what it’s like to stand up for something in a very public way.
Because this is the internet age, remember. Anyone can post anything about anyone.
I told the people I interviewed for A TWISTED FAITH to be prepared to take a few hits. I warned them that telling the truth, the uncomfortable truth, is never easy. That when you dare to share your tho
ughts and remembrances of a traumatic event some people will rush right up to you.
And stab you in the back.
I cherish truth and courage. I ask for truth when I’m writing someone else’s story. But the courage comes from them when they dig down deep, face the ugly, and still find a way to share it. When I wrote the book about the Dawn Hacheney murder case, I knew that Lindsey Smith, Bob “PB” Smith, Diana Tienhaara, Nicole Matheson, and Annette Anderson would be on the front lines.
I know that none will necessarily agree with everything I wrote, but I’m grateful to them just the same.
I’d like to share some comments made in response to a thoughtful post that Annette wrote for MomLogic.com late last year. In the post she – not I – wrote she talked about the importance of telling the truth and how she gathered the courage to do so. She was candid and direct.
When you have a moment read what she wrote. But pay equal attention to the comments. At last count there were 64 of them. Some were supportive, and many were not. Annette, trying to explain why she did what she did, answered some. As the author of the upcoming book, I did too.
Best friends Annette Anderson and Sandy Glass
Here’s a snip or two:
I’m really glad you shared your story, Annette. It takes a lot of guts to do the right thing and you’ve handled it with such grace. Hang in there and keep building on the great life you’ve made for you, your husband and children. – anonymous too
I appreciate your thoughts and comments. I agree that my naiveté made me vulnerable to this type of exploitation by my former pastor, but on the other hand I was in church, giving my trust to those who professed themselves to be devoted servants of God. It is a terrible reality that predators lurk in such places. While organizations certainly have their flaws, it is the people that make them either good, or evil. – Annette
Was he hot?- Anonymous
Nope, Nick wasn’t “hot” but he was charismatic and possessed a kind of “I really, really care about you” demeanor that (either real or manufactured) seemed to draw women close. He had intimate relationships with at least four members of his church. – gregg olsen
Although this is a terrible example of what faith should be, I believe the writer shows remorse and has learned that we cannot put our all of our faith in people but we need to put it in God. I think it took her courage to write this and I know God will set her free from guilt. There are many wolves in sheep clothing, God will reveal who is who. May her faith grow and she can learn from this because she was a victim of satan’s plans and coercion. – anonymous
I am so impressed that you have the courage to come out front with all of your “dirty laundry” We ALL have it but most of us want to keep it hidden! Thanks to people like you others know that they are not alone.(and maybe not so bad off!) They can see that there is the light of God to bring us out and His mercy to heal and forgive us. What a testimony you have. I pray that you will not be discouraged but continue to grow in your faith and continue to share. – C
One of Nick Hacheney’s relatives picked up the first rock and hurled it:
Christ Community Church, Bainbridge Island, Wash.
Everyone can go back to all the comments I wrote! I swear on everything I have, I am telling the truth. You confided in me on several occasions. Annette, I was also there!!!!!!!!! You were not abused, or a victim, or molested, or brain washed. You knew what you were doing. Also knew it was wrong. You had other woman from the church telling you to back off as well as your own pastor.. .remember him?? Pastor Bob..he was your pastor. Not Nick. As I said, the truth according to Annette. You are disgusting! Now, I have tried a few times since your reply.. and my comments are not getting posted. Is that you doing that Annette? Anyone can find me on Facebook. Tami Parcells..look me up if anyone has questions about this liar. She is a self-centered attention craving liar. Apparently, that has not changed. She had no secrets…because everyone knew. Everyone knew, because she told them and made it so obvious.- annetteisaliar
A few more posts later, another Nick apologist chimed in:
Wow! Where are all of Annette’s defenders now?? Looks like some of those other comments had a little truth in them after all. Tami sure shut every one up. You guys look like a bunch of idiots. I don’t know who to believe. If you’ve been living with this for over 10 years, aren’t you ready to put it behind you and move one?? Get over yourself. As long as you keep putting yourself out there as the poster child for this book, people are going to keep questioning your motives. Come on Annette, you’re not trying to save the world from evil pastors, you’re plugging a book. – kathy45
Hmmmm. About plugging a book…. Annette isn’t plugging a book, Kathy45. Something traumatic happened to her (and she takes accountably for her part in that) and she wanted to tell her story so that
A Twisted Faith by Gregg Olsen
others might learn something from it. Is that so hard to understand?
Finally, someone comes in and sets the record straight.
Wow, what BITTER women Tami and Kathy45 are! First of all: Tami, Annette’s supporters haven’t gone anywhere, so don’t worry your pretty little head. We just have busy lives and don’t have the luxury of sitting at a computer all day to make nasty posts! It is important to note that you are a bitter foster sister of Nicks that appears to have been brain washed too. I hear he is good at convincing people he didn’t do anything wrong. Nick killed Dawn. You would have to be stupid to not get this! Does propane for Christmas scream ” I LOVE YOU” to you. How about we put it next to Dawn’s side of the bed and plug in an electric heater. WOW, I would so feel loved by my husband by such sediments! Wow, amazing how Dawn’s purse was forgotten in the car overnight. Amazing how all the important papers were in her purse too. Come on Tami, Nick killed Dawn! This is why he is in jail! – Anonymous
So I’m asking the readers of the book (especially those who were members of the church and community) for their take on this kind of judgment-without- the-facts that seems to rule our world these days. What do you think happened to Dawn Hacheney on that Christmas night?
And yes, you can post anonymously.
April 1st, 2010 at 7:11 pm
I think Sandy Glass knows exactly what happened to Dawn AND who set the fire. Sandy, the complicit coward, should have a nice time in Hell. I hear they have cookies.
April 2nd, 2010 at 6:48 am
I think it’s sad that Nick hasn’t come clean with his family. He’s left them out there to make fools of themselves, defending him like Tami Parcells does in this post.
April 2nd, 2010 at 8:43 am
What do I think happened to Dawn? She died. Tragically. We may all have our ideas about what happened, but ultimately the person/people responsible will have to answer for all of their earthly actions. They will not answer to us, but instead to God. And he will judge them. So many people have been hurt throughout this situation. As someone who has known Nick and his family for many years and was close to many of the women & families in this story, went to Christ Community Church, I wish we could all remember how many fragile, lovely, good-intentioned people were hurt. Women. Their children. Their families. Hearts were broken, lives were shattered & vitriole and accusations don’t help anyone heal. I think it is sad that so often in supposedly Christ following communities, there are more stones thrown than love offered. I may not know every fact of what happened throughout all of this, but of one thing I am absolutely positive: Jesus would not be throwing stones.
April 2nd, 2010 at 9:00 am
To kathy45, you can’t move on until the truth is out there, now it is!
April 2nd, 2010 at 7:53 pm
I agree with you, Crystal, that Jesus would never throw stones. And for this I am eternally thankful.
I actually can and do understand Nick’s relatives, and why they’d be so upset at the truth–especially if this is the first time they’re hearing it.
April 2nd, 2010 at 9:58 pm
As some one dangerously close to the situation, I can and will say that Dawn was without a doubt murdered by Nick. When I received the call about her death, I knew instantly. Nothing added up. I believe that is why I was graciously spared from getting wrapped up in Nick’s web. My mind was on alert. I LIVED with Sandy and Jimmy until May of 1997. I saw the changes happening before my eyes up until I moved and was shocked when I came to visit a few weeks later. I lived with and worked for Nick’s mom until two or three weeks before Dawn’s tragic death. I understand why the family has a hard time with the truth. But it is the TRUTH which is sadly sometimes painful. It doesn’t mean we should deny it. It is traumatic to bring some one down from a pedestal they have been perched on most of their life. It shakes your world view.
I remember witnessing so many little parts to the story and feeling as though I was reading into things as I connected the dots, so I dismissed them instead.
Nick was a very inappropriate man, to say the least. Yet he was subtle and manipulative. Most of the time, he could get anyone to do exactly what he wanted and was angry if he couldn’t. He was great at projecting blame on his victims. He had a way of ousting people that either got in his way or that he couldn’t control.
Truth brings understanding which in turn brings peace. This is what the book has done for me. I think the saddest part for those that cannot embrace this, is that they will never walk in true peace and forgiveness. Nick has sent a ripple of pain out from all that he has done. Those touched by it have two choices. They can either embrace truth, choose to forgive despite his lack of repentance, and allow love and peace to fill their lives. OR They can deny the truth, live in sorrow and battle those that stand in truth, refusing to forgive, and never experience untainted peace again.
April 2nd, 2010 at 10:59 pm
As someone who was an outsider and entered into this mess as it all began to unravel in 2001 I am amazed at the extreme sensationalism, half-truths, innuendo, and even hatred in many, certainly not all, of these posts. The last 9 years has been pretty eye opening for me. I’ve personally experienced the Christ-inspired love, forgiveness and grace of many. James and Mary Glass specifically spring to mind. It still amazes me. I’ve also met many of the people involved, had them as guests in our home. I’ve seen the bonds of friendship wither and break under the stain of the pain and anguish caused by this incident. I’ve watched as people’s children, now, 12 years later, as adults have to relive these events. There is no doubt that Nicholas Hacheney murdered his wife. There is no doubt that he used whatever information he could get, his obviously innate ability to read people, to manipulate and control people, especially women, vulnerable women and then mentally and sexually abuse them. It’s clear to me that this wasn’t about the physical sex act. It was about his ability to manipulate and control his victims. And I truly believe all of the women involved here are victims. But there are many other untold victims caught in the collateral damage. To the people here who try to speak to truth and God’s grace, who don’t cower behind anonymity, God bless you. To the cowards who namelessly condemn and accuse others, I say only what I said when I first heard this story: “Get legal advise and take your story to the authorities.” Let them investigate and let the chips fall where they may. Today is Good Friday, I remember His sacrifice, his suffering for me. I’m thankful for the grace and forgiveness Christ gave to me. God bless us all this Easter weekend.
April 3rd, 2010 at 11:59 am
The only victims I see here, aside from Jimmy and the boys, are female victims of stupidity. The Lord CLEARLY stated his first 10 rules, The Ten Commandments! All of them knew this long before that wingnut came into the picture. Most of these women had strong men by their side, but for some reason they were looking on the other side of the fence. God Bless Annette for coming forward and sharing so much!!! It is fantastic that their marriage is so strong now!!! Sadly, others fell apart. Some lost (women) the best thing they ever had……
April 3rd, 2010 at 1:01 pm
Without getting into too much of a back and forth about biblical teachings, Blaundy is correct there are the 10 Commandments. But both old and new testments are riddled with examples of why we need Christ’s salvation, grace and forgiveness. I rarely quote scripture for fear of being wrong or taking it out of context, but Jonh 8.7 seems to apply in this instance.
April 3rd, 2010 at 2:13 pm
I just wanted to say that Gregg met with me and my husband when he was doing research for this book. We had been a part of the church and had even lived with Nick and Dawn in their Bremerton home for a few months.
I came away from that first meeting with Gregg with a feeling that Gregg truly cares about ALL of the people whose lives had been touched/affected by this tragedy, most importantly, Dawn. I know that Gregg spent A LOT of time and effort to try to get as much information from actual sources as he possibly could. I believe that Gregg wanted to share with the world who Dawn was, to share her story as much as Nick’s & everyone else’s. I believe Gregg was trying to get THE TRUTH out there, as acurately as possible, and I don’t think he took this task lightly.
I don’t think it is fair or right for anyone to criticize Gregg’s motive, without knowing him. I would ask if any of Gregg’s critics have even met him? Or are they just feeling defensive because they are Nick’s family member, and they don’t want Nick to look bad because it might reflect poorly on them? Or are they critical because they have bad feelings toward the church in general?
And as for Annette, I think she is very brave to come forward with her story. It is not as if she is gaining anything from this. To me, it appears that she has put herself “out there” not for selfish gain, but to help other women. I have great admiration for Annette.
I guess there will always be critics. Just because someone criticizes you, that doesn’t necessarily mean you’re doing something wrong! “If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first.” (John 15:18)
April 3rd, 2010 at 2:16 pm
Scott, that’s a such a great passage in John, speaking about Jesus prompting those without sin to cast the first stone.
As for the issue of forgiveness, I actually think 1 John 1:9 applies: If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
April 3rd, 2010 at 2:18 pm
Thanks Julie. And I agree with you about Gregg…
April 3rd, 2010 at 3:38 pm
Annette, to clarify, John 8.7 was addressing those making disparaging comments about those involved. The grace and forgiveness was in regard to the sacrifice and resurection we celebrate this weekend. Again I don’t normally quote scripture as I am woefully inadequate. Someday I hope we can meet outside the courtroom. It would be good for all I think. God bless you and your family.
April 4th, 2010 at 11:19 am
April, that was so well said, thank you for your honesty and insight into this.
April 7th, 2010 at 6:12 pm
So much has been pent up for so long, I spoke wrong. I felt that I had chosen my words carefully. But…. After much thought and having read all these responses, I see where it would appear I was casting stones. What I should have clarified was that I meant back them, not that I see people that way now. Judge not, lest ye be judged.
April 8th, 2010 at 6:33 am
Debbie I loved your post and am reminded that the truth that sets us free is the Truth of Christ Jesus, on the cross and risen again. Standing and walking in the GRACE of the Lord helps us to deal with all the destruction left as a consequence of choices we made, sin that we walked in. Accepting, repenting our own, and forgiving others sins allows us to walk in truth and thus accept Christ’s amazing gift to us. Some people think its better to walk with blinders and accept what they have been told with out question. But with blinders you miss so much in life. Hiding even part of the truth hardens your heart and makes it impossible for you to trust anyone let alone God. How can you accept God’s grace if you cannot trust? Just some food for thought. To those that support Nick, I know it is difficult to embrace the possibility that you have believed true for so many years and to do that your view of a man you hold dear would have to change. Do not dig your heals in for fear of the unknown. Open your hearts and minds and let truth speak.
April 8th, 2010 at 6:44 am
Let me clarify my last two sentences, it appears I did not proof read very well.
What it should have said was:
To those that support Nick, I know it is difficult to embrace the possibility Nick is guilty and not the man you believe him to be, especially after believing for so many years. Do not dig your heals in for fear of the unknown. Open your hearts and minds and let truth speak. God will not leave you hanging, peace will come and your struggle will be over.
April 8th, 2010 at 12:33 pm
Your posts April are very nicely put.
April 9th, 2010 at 11:12 am
I’ve updated the http://www.atwistedfaith.com site with the latest newsclips about the case involving Dawn Hacheney, Nick Hacheney, Sandy Glass, Robert Bily, and other members of Christ Community Church.
April 9th, 2010 at 8:31 pm
OK – let me get this right. This woman says she had sexual intercourse (repeatedly) with her Pastor while married to her husband and she did this for no other reason than the pastor told her it was God’s will??? I just saw the dateline story and I was shocked to see her husband was still sitting next to her. I don’t get it AT ALL!!! Something is not right here and anyone who denies the sickness in this woman and in this marriage should not be surprised when Annette has sexual intercourse with another man other than husband AGAIN & AGAIN & AGAIN …..
April 9th, 2010 at 11:14 pm
I went to school with Nick since 1st grade, he always thought highly of himself and I believe his messages from God were actually from the devil. I also attended school with Tami, she was mean spirited, bitter & rumored to sleep “around” herself…hm. I wonder why Ron & Theresa (his brother & sister) have not voiced their opinions?
April 10th, 2010 at 6:09 pm
I’m reminded of another NW man who could easily dupe so many women and twist their lives and all those that loved them. He, like Nick Hacheney was a sociopath or psychopath. I’m speaking of Ted Bundy. Nick may not have been on the same level as Ted, but I think they both graduated from the same school in hell before landing on earth. Those that refuse to face the facts and can’t believe that Nick could have murdered should go back and read “Stranger Beside Me” by Ann Rule. Even Ann was fooled and felt duped.
April 11th, 2010 at 9:13 am
I’ve just finished the book. I applaud those who came forward through all that transpired. Each individual’s part in what really is ultimately between them and their Lord. His grace is endless.
I did feel Sandy Glass was demonized in the book. I don’t blame the author or anyone involved but perhaps Sandy would have done better to speak out — only she knows.
It appeared to me that she was as much a victim as any of the other women, and accusations are just that, accusations — not truth. It was beyond sad to me that believers in the love and redemption of Jesus could accuse another sister. I hope Annette can forgive Sandy as Annette was forgiven herself.
I’m not involved in any of this and don’t know anyone involved. This was my take solely from reading the book. FWIW.
April 11th, 2010 at 11:54 am
Mel, I really appreciate your take. You speak with wisdom and mercy, and I hear you.
And I agree with you on the necessity of forgiveness, no doubt about it. You may be interested in reading this:
http://incoldblogger.blogspot.com/2010/04/faith-forgiveness-and-necessity-of.html
April 11th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
After watching dateline I’m sadden to see the lack of accountability with both Craig and Annette, and how they portray themselves as victims. The role they played in the church as being part of the Super Spiritual click, and the spiritual abuse that went on for years, hurt many people. They stood by Nicks side for years feeding his pride and ego, and contributed in much of the mind controlling abuse that went on there as much as anyone else in leadership did. When we tried to warn any of them. we were bullied and harassed, we were told to repent or we were headed for hell. It wasn’t rocket science to see the sickness you all feed each other. Nick used all this for his own sexual sick advantage. But you all (you know who you are) were just as guilty for the manipulation, mind control,and abuse as Nick was. When we attended CCC we were harass for leaving and talking to other Pastors just seeking help to define what was taking place there. anytime someone would start to catch on to the garbage that was going on there, you would all stick together and ostracized the others that were trying to shine the light. I think that’s what happened to Dawn she stated catching on and was silenced. Craig you didn’t see what was happening to your marriage because you didn’t want to. just like you didn’t want to see anything wrong with Nick. The last time I seen Nick he and others were very hateful towards us. we didn’t go to church that night to gloat or to say I told you so. We went to show our sadness for the church split. and only got hateful glares AGAIN!!! I thought It was ironic that you put a pitcher of our home group with us in it on dateline considering we were never considered a part of your elite group. We were the enemy, at the time it was very painful to be against such a strong group, but now I’m grateful to God we were. I have learned to not put confidence in man. and I am learning to forgive, this has brought up some strong emotions I have been burying for years. I’m trying to separate the sin from the sinner. Looks like healing for us is still in process.
April 11th, 2010 at 12:55 pm
Tammy, I’m so sorry. Genuinely sorry, and I do understand some of what you’re talking about. Please feel free to contact me privately (fb) if you’d like to.
Dateline was about some things, but it certainly wasn’t everything.
April 11th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
Ive been waiting 14 years for the “I’m sorry” Annette, and I do forgive you in the superficial christian way I am suppose to, and I am very happy you and Craig are together and attending a church you trust. I don’t wish you any harm or ill-will. Nick got his sentenced I’m sure you and everyone involved had yours in your own way. There are many that have there own story of CCC and just wanted to share a small part of mine. If were telling the truth shouldnt we tell the whole truth. Maybe that will be in book #2.
April 11th, 2010 at 8:08 pm
Tammy, I understand all too well what you have said. It is hard to have all the pain and emotions that have been buried so long come back. There has been much injustice committed to many in the last 14 years. The whole truth does need to be told about CCC (now known as Hope Center).
April 12th, 2010 at 1:29 am
Lucky Pastor… Just in case you meant me… Lisa…I am Jim’s second wife. And yes I am sooo sitting by his side. I grew up with all these peoples…………. life has been a bit crazy…
April 12th, 2010 at 8:45 am
I read this book over the weekend…after seeing the story on Dateline. This story so parallels another story I am familiar with… Wayne Bent and Strong City. To those who seem to be unable to comprehend how these women could be “duped”, I think you have very little understanding of the dynamic at play. It is a grooming process really. Selection of the “appropriate” victim or victims is the first step. The second step does involve a form of brainwashing. In this case the fact that the acts committed by these women (sex outside of marital bonds) with a pastor seemed at first-blush so egregious, led them to believe it must be sanctioned by God. The reasoning that follows is this “man of God” would never ask me to do anything so off-base…”it isn’t understandable because it is the work of God and to be faithful, I am not to question.” I do wonder what happened with Sandy Glass, as it does seem her “prophesies” helped move things to the next level, but only she is capable of knowing what (if any culpability) she has in the events. Seeing someone’s wife dead (eventually telling Nick H. that his hands were untied) was definitely questionable in my book. I am not judging her personally, but I do think we need to learn from these stories, as they do indeed tend to repeat themselves. Look up the Wayne Bent/Strong City story and see for yourselves…ugly old man managed to bed his son’s wife and many other of his married flock after telling them God had dissolved their earthly marriages and that he was Jesus reincarnated. Once he moved on to young women and underage girls (by telling them they had to be “naked before God”)and inviting several to lay with him in bed chest to chest the authorities got involved and sent him to prison. It was strange to me at the time that God only instructed that he defile the pretty women…not the old or the ugly, though apparantly some of them volunteered. He is now in a New Mexico prison and his flock awaits his triumphant return. UGH!
April 12th, 2010 at 8:59 am
Annaliese, I watched a documentary on Wayne Bent a year or so ago and very much noticed the same similarities. At that time Wayne Bent maintained a website where the women wrote of their experiences. It was disgusting to read; the parallels to Nick’s spiritual rationalization were uncanny. Disgusting, wrong, sad, I feel for the women that he has under his hypnotic control.
Thanks for commenting here.
April 12th, 2010 at 9:54 am
I find myself having to take this book in bits and pieces. Normally, I would already be finished with a book this size; but, as I’m only on page 120, I find my mind trying to wrestle with the Nick I knew in the late 80’s to the Nick that is portrayed in this book. One thing is clear: Power corrupts. Nick exploited his place in the church, it seems, for his own sexual gains. That’s not a rare thing, though. We’re all shocked that this comes in a church environment…but, a church is basically just a business. And, I have witnessed the same type of behavior when it comes to employees and people in a managerial position.
April 12th, 2010 at 12:49 pm
Wow, this is such a sad story. I think people forget that there are snakes even in the backyard. We need to remind ourselves that God will never NEVER contradict Himself and give “new” revelation- He will not ever go against His Word. Trust not in what people say but in what God has already said in the Bible. Perhaps the good to come from this story is to uncover the eyes of those in similar situations around the country. There are many being deceived and hurt and the Christian faith is not the only place it is happening. As for the Andersons, I want to hug them-squeeze them- for not giving up! For their courage to stay together and forgive! For the hope of forgetting! For you both I have a verse for you which ministers to me through my own set of pains- Jesus is speaking to Peter and asking him if Peter loves Him, and reveals to Peter how Satan has asked to “sift you as wheat”. Luke 22:32 “But I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail, and when you have returned to Me, strengthen your brethren.” NKJV Troubles will come and God will allow some things to happen that are truly painful- and we may never understand for what purpose it bafalls us- though we may know it is ultimately for His glory and the encouragement of others. Thank you for your humility in sharing your story and I pray for your continued strength. As for Dawn, she is the true hero, and for those who wish for Nick and Sandy to go to Hell, if you have ever been there you would not wish it. I pray for their TRUE salvation, that they may live with the conciousness of what they have done, coupled with the fact that they will face God for it. “It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the Living God” Hebrews 10:31
April 12th, 2010 at 5:51 pm
Annette, I think it is interesting that you see the parallels in the Wayne Bent Strong City story. I am curious what has happened with PB and his wife and also what happened to Robert Bily. I must admit that Mr. Bily’s appearance and contenance made my hair stand on end. I find him (for lack of a better word) creepy!
April 12th, 2010 at 10:59 pm
Annaliese, PB and his wife are together and doing so well. Robert Bily is still running some form of a “church” on Bainbridge Island.
April 13th, 2010 at 5:27 pm
Good to hear about PB and his spouse. It’s funny how you can almost feel you know somebody when you read about them. I think I read somewhere that his daughter Lindsay is married and doing well also…good for her. One wonders what her life would have been like if she had been with Nick H. I wonder what makes a person like Nick? I often think that it is a lack of personal responsibility…not too much for the philosophy that the “devil made me do it”. I am the daughter of a woman who is agnostic, but she is so giving, caring, and never has a bad word to say about anyone. Due to her questionable faith, I often think that she would be ripe for the picking for the devil, yet she lives a life that is completely oriented to the service of others.She calls herself a “humanist” and says she feels that it is her responsibility to help her fellow man not for a heavenly reward but because she should be “good for goodness sake”. My outlook is very different, as I am a very faithful person…she always took us to church growing up, as she thought it was an important “foundation” This so confuses me!
April 14th, 2010 at 8:22 am
Just finished reading the book. Gregg did a great job; but, I came away with more questions than answers, I think. Is it possible to come up with a different scenario where Nick could have been innocent of the crime, or where maybe he wasn’t the only one involved? If I was on a jury and given all the information provided, would I have “reasonable doubt” about the case? One thing is very clear: Nick abused his power in the church…and, from what I see, had admitted to those transgressions when pressed about them.
April 14th, 2010 at 1:02 pm
I think anything is possible…but too much evidence pointed to Nick. My son, a teen at the time, went on a short mission trip with some of the youth in the church with Nick in charge. He came back from that trip angry and could not express what he felt. I never encouraged him to participate in anything regarding the youth ministry again. Instead, he became involved with another church youth group. He is 29 now and has a masters degree in philosophy and is a jr. professor. He told me last Christmas that Nick was the only person he has ever met that could make you feel responsible and guilty for what he(Nick)did wrong. After all these years, my son has finally told me some of the incredulous things that Nick did on that trip. Nick is a true con artist in every respect.
April 14th, 2010 at 3:14 pm
I still don’t know. Just because you are a great con artist, being able to woo women and get them to believe certain things, doesn’t necessarily equate to murder. Again, I’m looking at this as a possible juror would, and having to have no “reasonable doubt” about sending down a murder sentence. I read the Sandy Glass transcript of her testimony..which, I would believe would have to be the main testimony that would have sent Nick to jail…and, there are so many “I don’t knows” and changing of her testimony, even from the week prior to her being questioned on the stand, that it would make me severely question what she was saying.
For example, Nick calls and supposedly says, “It’s done.” Nick’s lawyer implies that he said, “It’s Dawn.” Not much is said in that conversation beyond that statement; yet, Sandy clearly states she knows for sure that’s what Nick said. Yet, so many other things that you think she’d remember…or that she claims to remember at a later time…seems unbelievable that she wouldn’t. (What I’m also surprised by is that I’m figure him saying “It’s done” was done after Nick has returned to the house … and I was wondering if “it’s done” could even have been in the context that it meant that Sandy’s prophecy was “done.”
Again, many, many questions with answers we might never know. And, I’m not saying Nick is innocent…I’m just saying from what’s provided, could I say I would have no “reasonable doubt.”
April 14th, 2010 at 9:15 pm
Very interesting, Tim.
April 14th, 2010 at 10:00 pm
Tim – I understand what you are saying. I can see how one would end up with more questions than answers. I must confess that I still have questions as well. The issue of the rings that Nick and Sandy purchased was a huge factor with the jury. All payments were made in cash installments but the last was made by Nick with a credit card after Dawn’s death. I believe “it’s done” referred to the fact that the prophecy had come to pass. When Sandy received the phone call from the prayer chain leader to tell her that Dawn had died, she was actually on the phone with Nick at the same. This is a complicated trial because so much time had elapsed since Dawn died.
April 16th, 2010 at 8:54 am
I tried replying yesterday, but it said I was sending spam and my message would have to be reviewed. Anyway, I’ll try again as to a thought I had about what you said above, Debby.
While I totally agree that the trial is very complicated, due to the fact that so much time had elapsed, I really wonder if Nick would have been better off with a speedy trial. For, then Sandy wouldn’t have felt betrayed by him and would probably have believed her prophecy would want her to stand by him. Also, since Nick supposedly confessed to the crime sometime after Dawn’s death, that would never have happened…and, all the stuff dealing with the numerous affairs might either not have happened…or not have been exposed right away.
April 16th, 2010 at 11:35 am
Gregg Olsen said somewhere in this site that it would have been ideal if Nick would have confessed and there would have been a speedy trial…but he did not and still maintains his innocense. The fact that Annette finally could no longer keep the secret from her husband got the ball rolling forcing Sandy to seek legal help and immunity. As a member of the church at the time, I feel that the apostle in charge should have quickly exposed the situation as he had knowledge of it. There were plenty of people who would have backed the apostle had he acted on this and probably preventing a death. The other pastor was out of town on an extended sabbatical. Before Dawn died there were only two women involved. After her death, Annette became involved and he tried with other women.
Hindsight suggests to me and in my opinion, that there was a powerplay happening in the leadership and the situation with Nick was used by the apostle to manipulate, control and cause division. Before the pastor returned from his trip(before Dawn’s death) the apostle was already sowing seeds of division among the central group of people thus causing a split in the church the following year.
April 21st, 2010 at 12:08 pm
To those who read the book and watched Dateline… do you have any comments about the Apostle Robert Bily?
April 26th, 2010 at 2:00 pm
Do you have a Waffle House near your church?
April 26th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
LOVED the stuff with Pastor Bily. (I don’t think I’d ever be able to refer to any pastor as an apostle. To me, an apostle is a higher classification.) Anyway, I could totally watch an episode that was completely devoted to that man. He’s completely wacked out of his mind.
April 28th, 2010 at 1:59 pm
Looks like Robert Bily is running a home church with a few other followers. I agree, he’s a fascinating guy and one of the reasons I picked up the book after seeing Dateline. It would not be too much of a surprise if that guy gets his own news show episode some day. Creepy is the word!
April 29th, 2010 at 8:36 am
I thought “Grease” was the word.
April 29th, 2010 at 12:09 pm
“Slick” comes to mind!
May 26th, 2010 at 1:37 am
Its interesting viewing the dateline show and reading all these comments – particularly to be doing so from my position, which is one of both extreme closeness to and extreme removal from everything that occurred. You all are very caught up in this. It occurred YEARS ago… I sincerely hope you have all moved on with your lives. Perhaps it is part of the healing process for each of you to discuss and re-discuss everything. However, why you all fell for it – why anyone falls for it – in the first place is something I cannot understand. Religion, particularly unhealthy extremes of religion, is truly the opiate of the masses – and each of you proved yourself to be such. Nothing personal to any of you, as I, in some form, knew you all, but its necessary to listen to the voice of reason within you rather than the amorphous “God” to which you all subscribe – or at least did subscribe to at that time. If you haven’t already – and its pretty clear from the statements above that you haven’t – its time to look at your own personal insecurities and shortcomings that have caused you all to turn to religion and believe the ridiculousness that was spewed from that pulpit – and so many others. Only then will you be able to move on. Good luck.
May 26th, 2010 at 6:51 am
If you’ve arrived at some higher level of personal wisdom and security then why hide behind an anon handle? Give me a BREAK.
May 26th, 2010 at 2:59 pm
The murder occurred YEARS ago but the involvement of each us under the influence of an opiate stupor is a much broader expanse of the issue we are all discussing. You do sound familiar and are either agnostic or an atheist. The fact that you claim to have known us all in some form is interesting but does that make you the all knowing and logical one?
I think each has reasoned within themselves as to why and how we succumbed to the ridiculousnes spewed from that pulpit. It really wasn’t so much what was said from the pulpit as much as what was going on with the persona of the man behind the pulpit.
Those of us who brushed against this perosnality (and for some who maybe stayed to long) is quite the big question. If you are so knowledgeable, then you would understand the persona of an individual with a narcisisstic personality disorder. And, you would also understand how intelligent well-meaning people can be mislead or deceived by men/women who crave power, etc. It happens!
I can only speak for myself regarding personal insecurities and shortcomings. You are right that we must introspect and for myself I did. But what makes you an authority on this? Listening to the voice of reason instead of listening to what you claim to be an “amorphous” God is what got us into trouble. For me, God and His Holy Word, is an existing “solid” form of reasoning. You are amiss in your logic as far as I am concerned. It is men who warp, shift, change shape, are incongruous, and are hugry for power and therefore are “amorphous” themselves.
I think you are someone who means well and sincerely hopes that we can all move on…trust me we are. We have learned much but healing can be a slow process and if there are still wounds in me or others, they need to be reopened. The fact that we can discuss this openly helps. God Bless!
May 26th, 2010 at 7:12 pm
Debra… Gelbach? I hope your kids are well. Just to clarify, I never said it did make me all-knowing or some authority and I am neither agnostic nor atheist… I love Christians’ methods of discrediting. My point is this: deep down, a real appeal of (organized) religion is power… for everyone. They want to feel like one of God’s chosen, feel like their acts will allow reap them rewards in heaven, and feel looked up to (particularly those who desire to have any role in “leading” or “advising” others). Its a see and be seen type of environment. While Nick Hacheney and Robert Bily exhibit an extreme and mutated strain of this drive for power, everyone in that congregation (and, certainly, congregations in general) had at least some small piece of it. So, while you all point fingers at the manipulators – which I don’t deny that they are and have first-hand experience of – its important to realize that your own desires led to your manipulation. The funny thing is that this desire for power and notoriety still shows itself via partaking in the book, dateline program, and discussing it repeatedly.
There are certainly other things you raised in your comments to me that I could address, but, given our differences of belief, don’t believe doing so would lead to any agreement. For clarification though, the voice of reason I was referring to was your inner ability to analyze circumstances and determine that something is off – not the voice of other men, regardless of whether they claim to have a direct line to God.
I’m certain you all will discount what I have said. Just remember, I am not saying I have gained any higher level of personal wisdom or authority. I am merely saying that you all had desires that led to your own hurt. It doesn’t make the manipulators any less culpable, it just makes you more culpable.
May 26th, 2010 at 7:51 pm
Anonymous,
I actually agree with much of what you say in your first paragraph. It is within the power of men to twist the example of Jesus, which ironically enough, should draw out our humility if we actually followed His example, and appeal to our pride and ego. Christ Community Church was outrageous, but in many ways it’s not terribly different than many Churches/Christians who find fulfillment in titles, status, self-righteous power, etc. Speaking for myself, it’s challenging to reconcile faith vs. Church, for sure.
Based on your “nut-shell judgment” type style, I suppose I can understand why you’d lump the book/Dateline scenario into your comment. I’m not really going to address my motives, as I generally don’t feel pressed to explain myself when provoked. But I am curious how you it is that you know why I do what I do, currently?
You claim to see a familiar arrogance or hypocrisy–and I guess I do too, in you.
May 26th, 2010 at 8:43 pm
I did not mean to sound accusing but you certainly portray yourself as non-christian and I was not trying to discredit you. That would be pointless.
You may find this interesting that I acutally agree with you on many things. I hate organized religion and I hate the idea of being looked up too. My only desire was to serve others. But the funny thing is that partaking in the book, dateline, and discussing this issue is to help others and ourselves to see the truth about this kind of situation and to realize that we as Christians sometimes forget to think logically. I could care less about notoriety. I did agree with you on the fact that we must introspect and question our inner ability to analyze circumstances to make a determination when something is off. This ability is different in all of us which is determined by many factors. Believe me when I say that I have spent the last six years introspecting.
Further, it might also interest you that I hold myself completely responsible for my own actions and decisions. However, sadly enough, most of us were taught to trust in those who seemed to be “good” spiritual and trained leaders. I DETEST those who knowingly take advantage of those who are willing to trust in someone they thought was “good” and deliberately uses them for their own purposes and that makes them “more” culpable. I also DETEST the fact that it is still going on.
I am not looking for anyone to agree with me. However, you have raised some good points of interest for me. Whether I agree with you or not is not the issue here. You wrote some challenging statements that I felt required a little enlightenment from my perspective.
I don’t know who you are but you seem to think that you know me? My kids?
May 27th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
To clarify: #55 was directed to Anonymous #53.
Anonymous why are you afraid to identify yourself?
Why are you hiding in obscurity when you claim to know so much about all of us in some “form” and you were involved/not involved on some level of extremeness?
I guess I mistook your sincerity!
June 3rd, 2010 at 4:36 pm
As a rebuke to you Gregg O. or the one that started this post. I feel it is unfair and bias of you to attack Tami Parcells and Kathy 45 for what they shared, It is the truth for them as they know it. You were not there while Annette was sleeping with Nick and they were, you have taken her story, which is the truth to her as she knows it, and have discredited them because she is Nicks sister. Could it be possibly that you yourself have become like those that attended CCC and have become judgmental and bias because you believe Annette and not them…. Just food for thought. and while I do not know tami or kathy personally.I do know Annette and did attend CCC. I feel I must speak out to what I perceive as UNFAIR.
June 3rd, 2010 at 6:03 pm
I just read through all of the above and fail to see where Gregg Olsen attacked anyone or showed that he is unbiased or discredited anyone.
June 3rd, 2010 at 8:10 pm
I honestly have no quarrel with Tami or Kathy 45. Specifically, I know that Tami loves Nick. I don’t know Kathy 45. I tried my best to be unbiased and kind toward everyone in the story.
It is true that admire Annette and others who have posted here. I don’t know Kathy 45. I understand that people don’t like Robert Bily, but I also know that he was the only one who really tried to intervene in the Glass-Hacheney situation. The pain caused by many involved in the church is shared by many. That means that everyone who was witness to what was happening shares in the tragic outcome in some (often) small way.
I am going to close this thread with one last thought. I feel for Dan Hacheney and his family and I wish only peace for them. Dan is decent and loves his son. There’s nothing sinister in that. We probably would do the same if we were dragged into this.